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Old 05-15-2004, 09:25 PM
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Default Homeschooling

New York allows parents to remove their children from school so long as the parents (or guardian) files a lesson plan at the beginning of the school year. Some of the benefits and costs of homeschooling are obvious and some aren't.

Do you think homeschooling is a good idea or no?
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Old 05-16-2004, 11:46 AM
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Benefits:
1. Your children have the opportunity to learn far more than they ever will in public school.
2. You get to watch your children grow up, not only physically but mentally and emotionally as well.
3. You get to teach your children that learning is something that is fun, not something you do because you're supposed to.
4. Your children get to learn what you think is important, rather than what a vocal minority of parents believe they should learn. (You get to read about Huck Finn, Holden Caufield, and Harry Potter. You get to read about Snowball and Napolean and all those other crazy animals on the farm.)
5. You get to go on field trips again.
6. Your children get to learn about drugs, sex, and violence from you rather than from an idiot behind the bleachers.
7. Your child IS the machine, not a cog in the machine.
8. You get to work in your pajamas and you don't have to buy the latest school fashion every month.
9. You can take a vacation whenever you want. (Disney World without all the crowds!)
10. You get to watch your children grasp new concepts and remember what it's like to learn something new.
11. You get to re-learn all that stuff you forgot (or maybe even learn something you "knew" but didn't really know).
12. Your children won't be labled as hyperactive or get prescribed ritalin just because they're acting like kids.

Costs -
1. It's hard work.
2. It requires that one parent give up their career.
3. It can be expensive.
4. Your children won't get in trouble for "public displays of affection".

Homeschooling is a great idea, but it's not for everyone. Still, consider how many truly great people are products of homeschooling. Then consider how many truly great men and women have come out of public schools.

In Colorado, you only have to file a single piece of paper that says you will be teaching your kids at home. No lesson plan, no yearly filing. There are some record keeping requirements and they have to take a state test every other year though.
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Old 05-16-2004, 11:58 AM
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Home schooling is awesome if you do it right. While I worked at the College, the homeschooled kids in 99% of cases scored higher on the TASP and College entry exams than did kids from public schools. I think that sais it all. I am not sure what the rules are in TX to homeschool but I have seen the results and it is truly amazing how enthusiastic these kids are about learning ....
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Old 05-16-2004, 12:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grisu
Home schooling is awesome if you do it right. While I worked at the College, the homeschooled kids in 99% of cases scored higher on the TASP and College entry exams than did kids from public schools. I think that sais it all. I am not sure what the rules are in TX to homeschool but I have seen the results and it is truly amazing how enthusiastic these kids are about learning ....
The most prevalent argument against homeschooling is the theory that homeschooled kids are not as well "socialized" as public and private school children. (Some recently completed studies have shown that adults who were homeschooled are much more active in their community than other children.)

Did you notice any difference in this area?
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Old 05-16-2004, 12:15 PM
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Homeschooling does not mean that they lack social contact. Many parts of homeschooling curriculi contain classroom sessions, private tutoring, excursions etc. which generally are organized by a homeschool league or organization parents can join.
From observation, I can tell that there is a lot less usage of profanity, a kinder and gentler way of treating one another and a hightened respect towards others. I can also vouch for the quality of assignments turned in . I have also never had to remind a homeschooler of their due assignments, nor did I get excuses to cover failure. Maybe I just got lucky with the ones I came in contact with?
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Old 05-16-2004, 04:36 PM
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Quote:
1. Your children have the opportunity to learn far more than they ever will in public school.
Or by far less... Its almost impossible for you to have knowlege of many teachers that have by far more knowlege in their department than you. Child would be influenced with biased opinion on which subjects are more important and might cause him to choose his proffesion accordingly to what parents want him.
Quote:
4. Your children get to learn what you think is important, rather than what a vocal minority of parents believe they should learn. (You get to read about Huck Finn, Holden Caufield, and Harry Potter. You get to read about Snowball and Napolean and all those other crazy animals on the farm.)
LOL Than you should eliminate parents opinions. In my country parents have no say on what is taught in school (but they can help child in picking his secondary language).
Quote:
12. Your children won't be labled as hyperactive or get prescribed ritalin just because they're acting like kids.
What is ritalin?
Quote:
The most prevalent argument against homeschooling is the theory that homeschooled kids are not as well "socialized" as public and private school children.
Private or homeschool?
Well homeschooled kids would get isolated (more or less) from other kids.
Quote:
Homeschooling does not mean that they lack social contact. Many parts of homeschooling curriculi contain classroom sessions, private tutoring, excursions etc. which generally are organized by a homeschool league or organization parents can join.
Well that would meant that their social development would depend on their parents and not on themselfs...

Were any of you homeschooled?

BTW i can see the benefits of the homeschooling but im not sure that (all) parents can be trusted with so important thing. If anything goes wrong the child would be virtually destroyed and useless in society.
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Old 05-16-2004, 08:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond369
Or by far less... Its almost impossible for you to have knowlege of many teachers that have by far more knowlege in their department than you. Child would be influenced with biased opinion on which subjects are more important and might cause him to choose his proffesion accordingly to what parents want him.
As I said, the "opportunity" is there. I wonder if you're not operating under the misunderstanding that homeschooled children are educated exclusively by their parents; that is certainly not the case.
Quote:
What is ritalin?
Valium for children.
Quote:
Private or homeschool?
Well homeschooled kids would get isolated (more or less) from other kids.
That is a myth. Homeschooled children have many opportunities for socializing with other kids and they, by and large, take advantage of these opportunities.
Quote:
Well that would meant that their social development would depend on their parents and not on themselfs...
Up to a certain age, say 10, yes. Are you saying that children under the age of 10 are better judges of how best to develop their social skills? Personally, I would rather my children learn social skills from someone who has them.
Quote:
BTW i can see the benefits of the homeschooling but im not sure that (all) parents can be trusted with so important thing. If anything goes wrong the child would be virtually destroyed and useless in society.
Absolutely, but I think we already have far more "destroyed" adults due to public education than we'll ever probably have from a homeschool environment.
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Old 05-16-2004, 09:12 PM
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my nephew did a little homeschooling, it has to be pretty cool cause whatever his mom taught him he will ge graduating high school at the age of 12 and has a full tuition payed scholarship to SMU, his only draw back I think is sports participation
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Old 05-17-2004, 05:35 AM
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Homeschooling really depends on the strength of the parent to act as a teacher, rather than a parent. I think it's extremely hard for most parents to separate those two "worlds".

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatboy
Benefits:
1. Your children have the opportunity to learn far more than they ever will in public school.
This depends on the child's determination to learn, and the support they get from home. There are some very highly educated people coming out of some of the worst school systems around. Those kids apply themselves. It really has everything to do with the support of education that they get from home.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatboy
2. You get to watch your children grow up, not only physically but mentally and emotionally as well.
If a parent chooses to participate in their child's life, they can watch all of this too. Even if the child attends school. Parents do not take enough time to get to know their own kids. They choose not to participate in their lives, or spend the time with their kids to help them grow.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatboy
3. You get to teach your children that learning is something that is fun, not something you do because you're supposed to.
A parent who values educating themself will teach this value to their child. Being seen reading, and letting your child know that you're doing it because you enjoy it will accomplish the goal of letting them know that learning is fun. Once again, it's about participation in your own child's life.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatboy
4. Your children get to learn what you think is important, rather than what a vocal minority of parents believe they should learn. (You get to read about Huck Finn, Holden Caufield, and Harry Potter. You get to read about Snowball and Napolean and all those other crazy animals on the farm.)
What's important to one parent may not be very important in greater society. If the school system censors the reading material, there is nothing wrong with allowing your child to read that book on their own. Infact, it helps to reinforce your own values of reading. Let them read the outlawed books, and then spend some quality time discussing them with your kids.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatboy
5. You get to go on field trips again.
What's wrong with taking your kid on a field trip on Saturday? For most parents, that probably cuts into their golf game or their socialization. I also don't see anything wrong with telling the school that you're keeping "Johnny" out of school on a given day, so that he can go to work with you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatboy
6. Your children get to learn about drugs, sex, and violence from you rather than from an idiot behind the bleachers.
Every parent should be having this conversation with their kids in the first place! It's no excuse not to talk with your own kids about sex, drugs, alcohol, violence. Supplement what the schools say. Ask your kids if they have questions on what they are learning. Teach them your own values!

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatboy
7. Your child IS the machine, not a cog in the machine.
This sounds very much like teaching your child that they are valued. It's a good lesson, and certainly one that is easy enough for a parent to teach.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatboy
8. You get to work in your pajamas and you don't have to buy the latest school fashion every month.
Actually, I think this is a very bad habit to teach a child. You need to let them know that dressing for success is part of the game. You don't want them to grow up and think that they can work in their PJ's.

At a certain time in your child's life it's a very valuable lesson to teach them about money and economics. You teach them that if they want the latest fashion, they need to have money to purchase it. That teaches them about hard, honest work, and about saving money to gain the things you want in life. Far too many parents fail to teach this lesson to their kids, and those kids grow up expecting society to provide them with everything they need.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatboy
9. You can take a vacation whenever you want. (Disney World without all the crowds!)
You can still do this even with a child in school. I have yet to do it with my son (he's too young right now to be in school), but I remember my parents doing it when I was a child. We got permission from the school, got all of my homework for the time we'd be gone, and my parents helped me with those lessons. If you work with the school, this really shouldn't be an obstacle.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatboy
10. You get to watch your children grasp new concepts and remember what it's like to learn something new.
That's what evenings and weekends are for. Spend time with your kids and reinforce the lessons they learned during the week.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatboy
11. You get to re-learn all that stuff you forgot (or maybe even learn something you "knew" but didn't really know).
See response to #10.

[QUOTE=fatboy]12. Your children won't be labled as hyperactive or get prescribed ritalin just because they're acting like kids.[QUOTE]

Kids who do not have extra curricular activities to release that energy ARE overactive in school. They have no outlet. I think the parents are to blame for putting kids on behavior modifying drugs. Those parents need to spend more time with their kids and give them activities to release all that energy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatboy
Homeschooling is a great idea, but it's not for everyone. schools.
If properly applied by the parents, I would agree 100%. The problem is, most parents will simply slack off, or not teach their children everything they need to know.

Social skills are a HUGE area that is lacking in homeschooling. We had a next door neighbor who home schooled her kids. One boy was 8 the other was 4 (maybe 5). The 8 year old had the social skills of the 4/5 year old. He was a real problem to be around because he had no idea how to act properly. He threw fits, cried a lot, was abusive to other kids he came in contact with.

Kids who are home schooled NEED to have interaction on a regular basis with other kids. They can't get it from home, and this is a huge part of a child's education that is lacking in home schooled kids.

In reality, home schooling is a great idea, but I think the best education your child can receive is a traditional one. One which the parent/parents supplement with lessons of their own. Parents need to get back into participating in their kids lives. They need to take some of the responsibility for their education and growth. They need to be there for their kids. :thumbsup:
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Old 05-17-2004, 10:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yankeefan1970
Homeschooling really depends on the strength of the parent to act as a teacher, rather than a parent. I think it's extremely hard for most parents to separate those two "worlds".
Parenting is teaching. You're teaching from the moment they come out of the womb.
Quote:
This depends on the child's determination to learn, and the support they get from home.
Again, that's why I said "opportunity". There have been far more highly educated people coming out of homeschooled environments than public school systems. Even if you exclude the time before there were public schools, I would bet that the ratio of "highly educated" coming out of homeschool environments would be higher than that of public schooled children. Homeschooled children also have a higher average score on national standardized tests than public schooled children.
Quote:
If a parent chooses to participate in their child's life, they can watch all of this too. Even if the child attends school. Parents do not take enough time to get to know their own kids. They choose not to participate in their lives, or spend the time with their kids to help them grow.
Yes, homeschooling is the ultimate in parent participation. However, even a parent that is participating fully in their public schooled child's growth doesn't get the opportunity to see the little daily things that effect that child.
Quote:
A parent who values educating themself will teach this value to their child.
Yes, it could happen. But the fact is we put our children in schools that look more like prisons than fun places to learn. They are taught a curriculum that is geared toward the lowest common denominator. They are placed into a social situation that breeds a disrespect of authority for the sake of simply being disprespectful. And this goes on for 35+ hours a week. Even a fully involved parent has a small sliver of that child's time in which to teach the fun side of learning. And before he/she does that, they have to surmount all of the negativity that the child gets throughout the week.
Quote:
What's important to one parent may not be very important in greater society..../ ...What's wrong with taking your kid on a field trip on Saturday?
You keep pointing out that it's possible for the parent to take on some of these responsibilities themselves. Isn't this teaching? Doesn't it prove my point that public schools aren't the best places to put your child? If you are going to have to take the responsibility for figuring out what they won't teach your kid in school, and then teaching that yourself, wouldn't it be simpler to just take on the whole thing?
Quote:
Every parent should be having this conversation with their kids in the first place! It's no excuse not to talk with your own kids about sex, drugs, alcohol, violence. Supplement what the schools say. Ask your kids if they have questions on what they are learning. Teach them your own values!
Again, yes of course. My point is that public schooled children get bombarded by false information, even when the parent is fully involved.
Quote:
This sounds very much like teaching your child that they are valued. It's a good lesson, and certainly one that is easy enough for a parent to teach.
No, that's not what I meant. Think back to your own education. Did you feel like you were directing what you were learning or did you feel like you needed to learn what they were giving you before you were paroled? Think Pink Floyd's The Wall and the assembly line of children going into the meat grinder. That's how I felt; here's what I need to learn and if I learn it I'll be set free.

Homeschooled children do not need to be taught that way. They can choose what they are interested in and the various disciplines are brought in to support that learning. They are their own instrument to finding out about their world, something they are naturally inclined to want to know anyway. Rather than suppress that natural curiosity by teaching them in an assembly line fashion, homeschoolers can direct their own education. The result is a greater retention of material and an understanding of how all disciplines interact.
Quote:
Actually, I think this is a very bad habit to teach a child.
Of course, to each his own. How long do you think your child's self-esteem will last when you tell him to dress for success in public school? If he doesn't wear the latest fashion he will be ostracized. Do you think the kids you see coming out of public school at 3:00 are dressed for success?

The point is, you create the dress code - not some failed bureaucrat or some gansta rappa.
Quote:
You can still do this even with a child in school.
My point is that it's easier in a homeschool environment.
Quote:
If properly applied by the parents, I would agree 100%. The problem is, most parents will simply slack off, or not teach their children everything they need to know.
That sentiment isn't borne out by the facts. If most parents who chose to homeschool simply slacked off then homeschool children wouldn't be scoring so high on national tests and college placement tests. Homeschool children also have a higher rate of acceptance to colleges than public schooled children.
Quote:
Social skills are a HUGE area that is lacking in homeschooling.
Again, this is simply not true, your personal experience notwithstanding. As I pointed out, homeschooled children are more active in their communities, politics, and have more stable and rewarding (according to them) personal relationships.

Walk through a high-school some day and tell me that this is a great environment for learning social skills. As a public school child your friends are most likely your own age. You are derided by those who are older than you and you harass those who are younger. Your society is the small clique of friends that you have, who have no better social skills than you.
Quote:
Kids who are home schooled NEED to have interaction on a regular basis with other kids. They can't get it from home, and this is a huge part of a child's education that is lacking in home schooled kids.
Why can't they get it from home? My kids get a lot of interaction with other kids. They have friends in the neighborhood, they have friends at the various activities they do. There are groups of homeschooled children that they get together with at various events (going to the museum, the zoo, a ball game). Are you under the impression that homeschooled kids are locked in their houses all day?
Quote:
Parents need to get back into participating in their kids lives. They need to take some of the responsibility for their education and growth. They need to be there for their kids. :thumbsup:
Absolutely, 100% agree. When did we stop participating in our kids' lives? When we agreed to hand them over to the state for the greater portion of their waking lives.
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