Is it not a tradition for wedding parties in Iraq to fire guns into the air? I remember reading something about one of the "guests" at this particular "wedding party" being questioned about gun fire.

The military typically has video cameras set up to record their shots, and the time leading up to the shot. How much do you want to bet that "wedding party" or not, there were shots being fired into the air.?

Let's also not forget that Iraq has been notorious for "spiking" a scene and then calling in the press. An explosion happens somewhere, and the area is seeded with fragments from a US missile. We've heard many stories in the past of the US firing on innocent victims, only to learn later that they were planted in a hostile environment (socall "human shields") or that they were actually corpses brought into an area to make it look like something that was not.

I think we need to hold off on this "wedding party" and hear all the evidence before passing judgement that the US somehow wronged some innocent Iraqi again. Somehow, I have my doubts.

http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.j...2&pageNumber=0

So maybe 25 of the 40 people killed were men of fighting age, that would perhaps be something from 18 to 60. Wow, good thing they were killed. And all the newborn sons shall be cast into the river, for else they shall one day be men of fighting age....
And a "suspected safe house"? Well better to bomb than to be sorry I guess.
I wonder if that "significant intelligence" is as reliable as the "significant intelligence" that lead to the whole invasion?

Now I will wait for any additional information about the incident, although impartial information will probably be hard to get. But the military's explanations don't sound very convincing at this point.

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You don´t listen to the news much, do you?
The wedding was rased to the ground because acording to the US military, they were fired upon. But the witnesses on the ground say they were just firing into the air, in celebration.So yes, there were shots into the air, Yankeefan.
So, would be fair to say that if they were fired upon, there must be some bullit holes in the chopper, hummm? Can we see them? Anyone wounded?

C´mmon, you´re not really serious on this, are you? You think the iraqis drive around with 40 dead bodies in the trunk of the car, hoping to stumble on a bombed site to drop the bodies all over and later accuse the US?
The incident was filmed. The press was there within minutes, along with ground troops. You don´t think they would notice a few guys carrying dead bodies into the place, hmmm?

The wedding party was real. There was a bride, there was a groom, there were guests, whole families, therefore ipso facto there was a marriage.
Another FACT is that several women and children were killed. So what is there to doubt about?
Even if it wasn´t a marriage, the women and children would still be dead!
Those imbecils probably heard firing and called in for immediate strike, without even knowing who was down there, and what they were doing.
Hell, even i fire into the air during new year´s eve!! Should i be worried?
Trigger happy fools, that´s what they are.

Oh, by the way, it´s true that they always have a camera filming the strikes, so it´s to be expected that there is a footage on that particular bombing run. If the US military is so confident of what happened, how about releasing it?
They release any other footage, so why not this one too? Or maybe they are hidding something?

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"Quincitilius Varus, give me back my legions!"
Emperor Augustus of Rome.

"These were more than two dozen military-age males. Let's not be naive...Bad things happen in wars."

-Major General James Mattis

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So, then you agree that there were guns in the area, and they were being fired into the air.

OK... Firing into the air has already been established. Do they need to hit something in order to have someone fire back at them? If a cop is on the street and someone pulls out a gun and starts shooting, should the cop wait until he's hit before returning fire? Or, should they assess the potential threat and take action?

OH... You fire at a military helicopter at night and see if you can hit it accurately. I'd also like to see you put a hole in one. They have this little thing on them called "armor". :thumbsup:

I'm not saying that someone was driving around with 40 dead bodies. BUT, I am suggesting the possibility that the wedding party was a front for a military base. Call them 'human shields' or 'unwilling participants'. Unless you live in South Central LA, I can't understand why you'd have that many people around with guns at a wedding.


Hmmm, indeed! The incident was filmed. I wonder why there'd be video cameras present at a wedding in Iraq? Do you think the press was just arriving to capture the beauty of an Iraqi wedding? OR could it be that the cameras were there to capture the "outrage" of a wedding being fired upon? Sounds like the perfect set up to me. "Cameras rolling... OK guys, start shooting at those American helicopters. We're going to really get them good this time. This will be all over CNN by tomorrow. HaHaHa."

Wait a minute... You've got me confused. You start off by saying that the wedding was real. Then, you end with "even if it wasn't a marriage". So, which is it? Was there a wedding or not? You seem to be a bit confused here. Is it because you are now doubting the truth behind this so called "wedding"?

Yes. Women & children were killed. If they happen to be in the area where there's a bunch of people shooting into the air, they got what they deserved. Yes. I just said that! If you're standing around in a crowd and they suddenly start shooting, do you think you're just going to stand there? Or, are you going to get the heck out of a bad situation?

How many times in the past have the Iraqis used civilians (women and children are their favorites) as shields? They parade the media in to get good shots of the little kids blown apart. What were they doing there in the first place? Any decent mother would remove her kids from the path of harm, UNLESS they were being duped into staying there, or being held.


A bit off topic, but I'd say yes, you should be worried. When you discharge a fire arm into the air, that bullet has to come down at some point in time. It's lethal on the way down too. Firing a gun into the air is actually illegal in most places in the US. You may not see the consequences, but what if you hit someone a few blocks over? Firing a gun into the air, even if you're not likely to be attacked by an Apache is still not a very smart thing to do.

So they should just release the video the second someone complains about something? Assuming they did capture what was going on, I'm sure we'll see the video soon enough. Right now, it's evidence. You don't just release that stuff without first seeing what's there. IF they swooped in and took out a wedding without provocation, I'm sure that will lead to another inquiry. You just have to give it time.

Even if they release the video, the response will be, "It's not the real video" or "They (the evil US military machine) must have doctored the film". It is a no win situation. We live in a time when terrorists are believed before American soldiers, humiliating photos of prisoners get more air time than the beheading of an American citizen, and the horrible loss of life is bemoaned - unless it's an American soldier.

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In this country, we don't need reasons to make things legal; we need reasons to make things illegal. - Startup

If that´s true, it´s of your own making.
You made the bed, now fuckin´sleep in it.

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"Quincitilius Varus, give me back my legions!"
Emperor Augustus of Rome.

I think that people hold the untruths of the Bush administration against anyone connected with the government. We have been deceived so many times since Bush took office that we have a knee-jerk reflex not to believe anything the government tells us.

I think the Iraqi abuse gets more air time because the beheading is what most people consider "business as usual" for the evil iraqis. Conversely, abuse from a county that paints itself as a caring nation is completely "out of character."

The soldiers would get more sympathy can news coverage IF that news coverage were allowed. We just don't normally hear about the deaths and we normally don't see the injured and dead soldiers so it is very easy not to think about it.

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The best daily political cartoons can be found here:

http://www.csmonitor.com/commentary/index.html

To be fair, I doubt it was fatboy who decided to invade Iraq. That is, unless fatboy is Dick Cheney's internet moniker. Hmmmm....

Note to self...accusing fatboy of being Dick Cheney was a shitty thing to do on his birthday. Must remember to apologise....

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The best daily political cartoons can be found here:

http://www.csmonitor.com/commentary/index.html

It was in the plural.

__________________
"Quincitilius Varus, give me back my legions!"
Emperor Augustus of Rome.