American beheaded on video by Al-Qaeda - Page 4 - Video Games Forum

janlefev · #31 (**permalink**) 05-23-2004, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ranger

After having watched this, does anybody here still believe that this war is "winnable"? As long as there are still a few angry muslim fanatics with kitchen knives left alive on this planet, won't this just continue? And on a broader scale, is a "war on terrorism" itself winnable? I honestly just don't see how it can be.

I suppose the media is very difficult to beat, especially when they will use any kind of visual trick to support Kerry, all with Al Qaeda help.
I didn't watch those video so I can't tell if it was made after the guy was killed. Did they show the stump ? Only if you could see red blood pouring out there you could say the cut is fresh.
The father of the guy wants to help campaigning against Bush. He may have been more usefull to tell his son not to try to make dirty money dealing with Al Qaeda, because it seems HE contacted them.

I think the left is crap and they tend to put the other under their lower standards of morals.

janlefev · #32 (**permalink**) 05-23-2004, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by macaw

I was truly angry at those dumbfucks who humiliated the Iraqi prisoners and were very dumb enough to take pictures of it and even video taped it they embarrassed a whole nation. But what these damned terrorists did to Berg was way way out of proportion and should be a reminder of what kinds of people the americans are dealing with here.

Right now Im very worried about Pfc Maupin and what kinds of outrage they might perpatrate on him, I hope they either cut a deal to free him or rescue him if they get good intel.

I simply see that as a manipulation.
I suppose some officers are trying to help Kerry. This is as simple as that.
That theory is very simple.
First those movies are sent to the media.
Those soldiers (I'd say they are basic GIs) declare they have been ordred to what they did. Everything has been filmed and nobody is able to imagine why those pcitures are so well interpreted. Then the Bush administration charges their officers, but those claim that the Administration (Rumsfeld) incited them to do that. This is against for the media since officers should know what are the rules of war and the administration knows that too.
I wouldn't be surprised if all those stories prove to be exagerated or even fancy simulations... after election, whoever wins.

SwamP_ThinG · #33 (**permalink**) 05-23-2004, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by janlefev

He may have been more usefull to tell his son not to try to make dirty money dealing with Al Qaeda, because it seems HE contacted them.

Uh???
Nick Berg contacted Al Qaeda? Never heard that before. Any links?
:confused:

lulu · #34 (**permalink**) 05-27-2004, 10:54 AM

No

hypedave · #35 (**permalink**) 05-27-2004, 11:14 AM

Either I was reading something recently or heard something recently that he was in contact with some terrorist indivuduals, it was something about the FBI being envolved as well, hold on let me google something up.

Berg, Al Qaeda linked before

Quote:

In a bizarre coincidence, Nick Berg crossed paths with Al Qaeda years before its henchmen beheaded him, when his E-mail and password wound up in the hands of 9/11 suspect Zacarias Moussaoui.

It happened in 1999, when Berg was at the University of Oklahoma and Moussaoui was enrolled at a nearby flight school, allegedly training to be an Al Qaeda hijacker.

After Moussaoui came under scrutiny in the Sept. 11, 2001, terror attacks, the FBI discovered he had Berg's university E-mail password.

"In 2002, the FBI was following millions of leads in the wake of 9/11, and one led to Mr. Berg," said a senior Justice Department official.

After questioning Berg about the tie, the feds concluded he had never actually met Moussaoui, who had friends and roommates at the same college.

The matter remained closed until Berg's ill-fated visit to Iraq this year.

When he was detained by authorities in Mosul in March, FBI agents came to grill Berg, and he volunteered details about his previous dealings with the bureau, the official said.

But the eerie link between Berg and the terrorist cabal that later decapitated him "turned out to be total coincidence," the official said.

U.S. intelligence officials have confirmed their suspicions that it is Al Qaeda associate Abu Musab al-Zarqawi who is seen killing Berg on the shocking videotape.

Using voice analysis, they determined that Zarqawi - a one-legged mystery man with a $10 million bounty on his head - was the hooded figure who wielded the knife.

Berg's family, however, is also blaming the White House for his gruesome death.

"Nicholas Berg died for the sins of [President] George Bush and [Defense Secretary] Donald Rumsfeld," his father, Michael, told reporters. "This administration did this."

The family produced an E-mail yesterday that appeared to confirm Nick Berg was in U.S. custody when he fatefully missed his plane out of Iraq in March - even though officials insist he was held by Iraqis.

"I have confirmed that your son, Nick, is being detained by the U.S. military in Mosul. He is safe," Beth Payne, the U.S. consular officer in Iraq, wrote to the family April 1.

The State Department told the Daily News Payne was misinformed, but didn't learn until April 7, a day after Berg was freed, that he'd been in Iraqi custody.

A police chief in Mosul, however, said Berg was never arrested by Iraqi authorities and Berg's own E-mails home said U.S. soldiers had been guarding him.

Berg, 26, had traveled to Iraq to drum up work for his radio-tower business and planned to fly home to West Chester, Pa., March 30 for a pal's wedding.

Because he was detained in Mosul, he missed his flight and was still trying to make his way home - through Turkey, according to one friend - when he vanished April 9.

U.S. officials have said they told Berg he should leave Iraq when he was released and offered him a flight back to safety.

But Michael Berg, an anti-war activist, said his son feared he might be killed on the treacherous route to the airport and decided to make his own way.

Michael Berg also took a call yesterday from presumptive Democratic presidential nominee John Kerry.

"He feels let down by, let down by those who should have been protecting his son," Kerry told Fox News' Alan Colmes.

A memorial is set for Nick Berg today, and high school friends have set up a Web site in his honor.

Somehow the government has concluded to it's just a coincedence, hmmm me wonders.

SwamP_ThinG · #36 (**permalink**) 05-27-2004, 12:54 PM

Well, that´s definitelly strange! Seems to me that there´s a whole lot about this story that we have no clue about. Could it be that Berg was an operative, and that´s why the Feds held him for so long? And that maybe, just maybe, the guys who beheaded him thought he had turn informant on them?
What we first thought to be a totally unrelated set of incidents might not be so unrelated after all. The thing is that most people won´t see past the beheading and won´t even bother to search for any other clues, and this whole thing will just slip into oblivion, along with all the other unresolved cases.

Let´s see if we can put the pieces together.

First, and believing this Al Qaeda link, Nick Berg gets into contact with Al Qaeda operatives. Why? We don´t know. Was he muslim? Was he in favour of Al Qaeda´s reivindications? Let´s get back on that later.
Then a war starts, Nick travels to Iraq a couple of times, and virtually disapeers from sight for a couple of years.
Then the FBI gets to him, holds him for two weeks without cause, the family files a formal complaint, and then the FBI alleges to have let him go, in a very dangerous moment when hostages are being taken left and right.
And the day after, he is supposedlly captured by insurgents/Al Qaeda. Then turns up dead, his head missing, after a couple of weeks in captivity.
Another coincidence is that he had been working at Abu Ghraib, fixing an antenna or something, during the period when the abuses suposed to take place. And just a few days after the Abu Ghraib scandall breaks out, a video of him being beheaded supposedly by Zarkawi surfaces. And he is wearing an orange jumpsuit, exactly like the ones awarded at the prison to the detainees. All very strange coincidences, or not coincidences at all.
It all seems to revolve around that prison.
It´s definetlly a mistery worth studying. Where´s Sherlock Holmes when you need him?
:indeed: :indeed:

hypedave · #37 (**permalink**) 05-27-2004, 01:57 PM

well I can't find the source at the moment, but do a search on google for

"Nick Berg, unemloyed, al queda"

The source I had spotted was saying something about how he was coming back and forth from the US because he no job in Iraq (thats the location right, forgive me if im wrong) and was still looking for a job over seas.

A report also indicated that his parents were at first denying anything about Nick and this strange meeting with the FBI, then they later came back and confessed to stuff, not sure how true that was, but I had found that source link on aboutus.com that other seach engine.

fatboy · #38 (**permalink**) 05-28-2004, 05:29 PM

And the plot thickens. For some reason, Michael Moore thought Nick Berg was an interesting inteview subject for his latest drama.

By Rebecca Traister

May 27, 2004 |

Filmmaker Michael Moore filmed an interview with American Nicholas Berg in the course of producing his documentary film "Fahrenheit 9/11," before Berg was taken hostage and killed in Iraq, Moore confirmed to Salon in a statement Thursday. The 20 minutes of footage does not appear in the final version of "Fahrenheit 911," according to the statement.

Word of the footage reached Salon through a source unaffiliated with Moore, or his film, "Fahrenheit 9/11," which is reported to feature stark images of U.S. civilians and soldiers grappling with conditions in war-torn Iraq, as well as examining the relationship between President George W. Bush and the bin Laden family. It received the Palme d'Or, the Cannes Film Festival's highest honor, on Saturday.

Robot303 · #39 (**permalink**) 07-22-2004, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Arab linguists have said the man posing as the Jordanian Zaraqawi did not speak with a Jordanian dialect. Others have suggested the man reading the written statement may not have been a native speaker of Arabic.

Zaraqawi was missing one leg and had been outfitted with an artificial leg that did not fit or function properly. He was unable to walk or stand normally with his ill-fitting limb. No man in the group showed evidence of such an infirmity.

Numerous indigenous sources have said Zaraqawi was killed by a US helicopter attack months ago when he was unable to move quickly enough to escape the targeted house. While others managed to exit the house in time to survive, he died in the collapsed building.

As any surgeon will testify, the alleged beheading was a fake. A beheading would result in a tremendous amount of spurting blood. There would have been blood everywhere had an actual beheading taken place. When the executioner holds up Berg's head immediately following what is represented as an actual decapitation of a living person, there is no significant blood flow from the neck or blood splatters showing anywhere on the executioner. Furthermore, the cut was simply too neat to have been done crudely and with such amazing speed by a man wielding a knife. Anybody who has ever carved a turkey knows there is something wrong with the supposed beheading. The suspended head looks more like Berg had been neatly beheaded by a guillotine.

The orange jumpsuit was standard US military issue to men in custody. It is unlikely Berg would have continuing wearing a US custodial uniform if he had been released by the military as they claim. The fact he was still wearing the suit is both anomalous and suggestive. One is forced to speculate as to whether there was an immediate transfer of Berg from the US military to unknown persons, thusly preventing Berg from discarding his US prison garb.

Several of the men in the film were fat by Iraqi standards. If they were Feyadeen or mujahadeen, they probably have been living underground since the first days of the occupation. Tens of thousands of Iraqis have been shown on news stories as they have marched and demonstrated. One would be hard pressed to point out a single fat man among these thousands.

Some men had what can only be described as pasty-white hands. Once again, one would be hard pressed to find Arab men with pasty-white hands.

The lack of spurting blood suggests Berg was already dead at the time of the alleged decapitation. It is possible Berg's dead body was displayed with his head already partially or totally severed. In any case, he almost certainly was killed before the staged beheading. If so, it suggests the captors had no stomach for an actual beheading of a living person, and they opted to fulfill their assignment quietly and with the least amount of gore.

The scream that is heard has been interpreted as a woman's scream by many viewers. Videotape cognoscenti have further said the scream was amateurishly added to the tape.

The U.S. government translation of one statement made on the film is: "Does al Qaeda need any further excuses?" This is a falsification. The actual statement urged fellow insurgents to get off their hind ends and do something. One assumes the translator being used by the US military is a native speaker of Arabic, so this cannot be explained as an innocent flub. This suggests the US government wanted to inject an alleged al- Qaeda group into the murder of Nick Berg.

Iraqis who have seen the videotape on Arabic news broadcasts are universally saying the men in the film are not Iraqis. Are they saying this partly because the speaker does not employ an Iraqi dialect? Where does their certainty come from?

Firearms experts have stated the AK-47 carried by one man was a "Gilal." This actually is an Israeli-made weapon that improves on the famous AK- 47. Feyadeen and other insurgents almost universally use AK-47s.

The man in the videotape who is purported to be Zarqawi is wearing a gold ring. This is absolutely proscribed by Islamic law.

The US military has stated that Berg was never in US custody and that he had been in custody of the Iraqi police. The Iraqi police adamantly deny he was ever in their custody. On April 1, an e-mail from Beth A. Payne, the U.S. consular officer in Iraq, was sent to the family of Nick Berg. It stated that Ms. Payne had located Nick, and he was currently in custody of the US military. We have to conclude that either the email was bogus or the US military has been lying.

The chair that Berg was seated in during the filming was a standard issue military chair of the exact same kind as seen in a color photo taken at the Abu Ghraib Prison. The chances a terrorist cell would be using this same chair are minimal at best.

Links
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